Linux Format forums

Re: Digital Rights management

Tux_Rocks — Sat Aug 06, 2005 6:46 pm

Author: Tux_Rocks

Posted: Sat Aug 06, 2005 6:46 pm

I really dislike the whole concept of digital rights management. If I buy an mp3 or whatever off napster I want to be able to do whatever I want with it. I think it's just about restricting what the user can do with media. The right way to catch software pirates / music pirates etc is to go after the worst offenders and not the end users. I shall steer clear of DRM for as long as I can. The DVD's I get have some form of encrption but I don't think that can be helped unfortunately.

Re: Digital Rights management

hairymunky — Wed Jun 15, 2005 8:19 am

Author: hairymunky

Posted: Wed Jun 15, 2005 8:19 am

Im going with the second method, just making a front-end ui for libdvdcss and dvdread libraries.
It will work with unencrypted files, and with libdvdcss it will decrypt locked dvds.

Still got lots of suff to sort out first though, but its getting there

Re: Digital Rights management

Nigel — Tue Jun 14, 2005 11:48 pm

Author: Nigel

Posted: Tue Jun 14, 2005 11:48 pm

So are you actually writing code to decrypt DVDs or are you just calling libdvdcss where necessary ?
If the former, you are likely to find yourself in trouble. If the latter, make it so it will work with unencrypted DVDs out-of-the-box, put hooks in for the decryption routines for protected DVDs with suitable error messages ("This DVD is copy-protected") if the library isn't found. Don't supply the library with the app, but let it be known that if you get it from elsewhere it "ought" to work with your app.
This seems to be how Xine gets around the problem.

Re: Digital Rights management

hairymunky — Tue Jun 14, 2005 11:21 pm

Author: hairymunky

Posted: Tue Jun 14, 2005 11:21 pm

youlikeicecream wrote:

DVD-region free for pc and anydvd for pc get rid of the "user-prohibitons" on dvds. would be nice to see something like that for linux. libdvdcss is great and quite necissary.

erm.. I'm creating an app, just like DVD Decrypter/Smart-ripper for Linux just now, but with the way things are (DVD Decrypter shut down), Im kind of wary of releasing the source code and getting my ***** to wear as earings
But then if I release it, its then in the public domain, free, open-source...
If P2P software isn't illegal, then it must be ok to make backups of DVDs you already own!!

Re: Digital Rights management

youlikeicecream — Mon Jun 13, 2005 6:44 am

Author: youlikeicecream

Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2005 6:44 am

Obviously realised the error that they made (revenue loss) Nigel. Unfortunate as the first version sounds like more fun than the second, bit of a drag when you have to buy 5 copies.

Mike

Re: Digital Rights management

Nigel — Sun Jun 12, 2005 12:17 am

Author: Nigel

Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2005 12:17 am

youlikeicecream wrote:

this concept of software licensing is best seen in pc networks games .. each person has a pc and a copy of a game each.. plenty of revenue (1:1) whereas in the games console market, it is possible to have , say 4 players playing on 1 console with 1 copy of a game.

The original Age of Empires would allow you to play multiplayer games with one CD for every 5 players. You do a full install on each PC, the one with the CD starts the network game and the others join in. We still occasionally have family AoE wars on wet bank holidays - it's great fun.
When Age of Empires 2 came out we were very disappointed to find they'd gone back to requiring each user to have their own CD.
Microsoft got a lot of things right with the first version of AoE. Pity they didn't keep it up.

Re: Digital Rights management

youlikeicecream — Sat Jun 11, 2005 11:21 pm

Author: youlikeicecream

Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 11:21 pm

MOPHP, i feel the same, its a ridiculous world. as Bill Hicks said, "You pay, you get ripped off, Free you get it all", I bought a Multi Region all-format reading DVD Player for �29 and it does the lot, but i have seen so many expensive ones that dont play hardly anything.

DVD-region free for pc and anydvd for pc get rid of the "user-prohibitons" on dvds. would be nice to see something like that for linux. libdvdcss is great and quite necissary.

its funny hairy monkey .. have you read the legal blurb at the beginning of most movies, where it says "not for public viewing ... lending, etc" that means that if you go to your friends house ... watch his film on his tv with a couple of other friends; Thats breaking the terms of the DVD !!! ridiculous.
this concept of software licensing is best seen in pc networks games .. each person has a pc and a copy of a game each.. plenty of revenue (1:1) whereas in the games console market, it is possible to have , say 4 players playing on 1 console with 1 copy of a game.

Mike

Re: Digital Rights management

hairymunky — Sat Jun 11, 2005 9:15 pm

Author: hairymunky

Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 9:15 pm

... and the "el cheapo" dvd players play any region dvd's! I thought all this region crap was meant to stop dvds coming from other parts of the world....
Canny beat a �29 player from ASA
Ive bought (legal) dvds from play.com that were region 1 (USA) and they play fine in my DVD player, and cost me a lot less than the region 2 version.

I think at the end of the day, it's just a ploy for the fat-cat rich companies to extort more dosh out of us hard working folks. I really hope it all goes pear shaped and turns and bytes them on the ar*e!

Another thing... whats the difference between borrowing a friends DVD to watch, or downloading a movie illegally (not that I do it or agree)...? I can't see any difference, maybe we'll have anti-piracy people arresting us for bowrrowing a film... hmmmmm shouldn't give them any ideas!!!

Re: Digital Rights management

M0PHP — Sat Jun 11, 2005 2:06 pm

Author: M0PHP

Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 2:06 pm

Might have been, I can't actually remember now

Re: Digital Rights management

nelz — Sat Jun 11, 2005 9:05 am

Author: nelz

Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 9:05 am

Maybe he doesn't want to admit to shopping at Aldi or Netto

Anyway, I thought Proline was Comet's own brand.

Re: Digital Rights management

Flea — Sat Jun 11, 2005 1:04 am

Author: Flea

Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 1:04 am

M0PHP wrote:

bought for �49 in a well-known supermarket

You know what confuses me even more than DRM? Its when people say stuff like that, why not just say "I bought it at ASDA" or "I bought it at Tesco" or wherever you got it from?

Re: Digital Rights management

1slipperyfish — Sat Jun 11, 2005 12:18 am

Author: 1slipperyfish

Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 12:18 am

ah but if you (i am not endorsing it ) used dvd shrink you could remove the adverts/encoding and watch it free from any censorship
paul

Re: Digital Rights management

M0PHP — Sat Jun 11, 2005 12:08 am

Author: M0PHP

Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 12:08 am

eBooks. Thats the worst medium to apply DRM to (in the consumer's eyes). Say I'm a student and I have two options for Topic A, and want to buy JOe Bloggs' Definitve Guide to Topic A:

1) Pay �15 for the paper-back book. With this, I can read it as many times as I wish. I can write on it if I so wish to make notes and indicates points of interest for a later date. Hey, I could even photocopy a page or two to give to my poorer friend or to read later when I don't need to carry around a tome with me.

2) Pay �15 for the eBook. I can now read it until my licence expires, afterwards having to empty my pocket again. I can't write (digitally) on it because oh no, that would be against the licence and/or copyright of the publisher. Can I make a copy of it to put on my laptop or PDA for when I go out? No chance.

On a similar note, we have 2x DVD players in the living room. One is a cheap PROline thing that we bought for �49 in a well-known supermarket. The other is Samsung, and was included in the entertainment thing we got (Wide TV, DVD, cabinet, 5.1 sound, amplifier and so on) which cost altogether over �500. The PROline will play just about anything I throw at it - (S)VCD and DVDs - even my backups. Even those DVDs that the so-called "copy protection" on - not a problem. However, take (for example) my Creature Comforts DVD. Stick it in the Samsung player and there is no way it will get past the first menu. PROline plays it fine. And this is the case for the majority of DVDs we've bought as well, useless.

On the subject of DVDs - the widely mis-used (by the DVD producers) is that they dictate when and where we can use our fast-forward and/or skip buttons. The function isn't used properly (it wouldn't be so bad if it was) but it's used to make us sit through adverts at the beginning!! As if we hadn't paid �7 to see the film at the cinema (with 30mins trailer first), we now pay for adverts included in our DVDs!

Sorry, got fustrated there

This "intellectual property" rights and stuff has a lot to answer for

Re: Digital Rights management

1slipperyfish — Fri Jun 10, 2005 11:33 pm

Author: 1slipperyfish

Posted: Fri Jun 10, 2005 11:33 pm

yes but watching movies/playing games doesn't have a time limit/number of watches/plays as drm is supposed to enforce
paul

Re: Digital Rights management

youlikeicecream — Fri Jun 10, 2005 11:18 pm

Author: youlikeicecream

Posted: Fri Jun 10, 2005 11:18 pm

I agree, the end-user is a bit herded unless they buy and install some commercial software such as DVD-Region free or similiar. Just another cost to the equation of watchingmovies/playingmusic/games/makingmusic/games/movies/thelistgoes on.