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This is good to see!
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ggsinclair
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Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2005 8:41 am
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 04, 2005 8:30 pm    Post subject: This is good to see! Reply with quote

Have a look.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/4406204.stm

Gordon Smile
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Rhakios
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 04, 2005 8:38 pm    Post subject: RE: This is good to see! Reply with quote

I'd still like to know how they gather these statistics. I have noticed that Opera identifies itself as IE by default and you have to change the setting to get anything else, would most users bother? There is also the issue of people setting their browser's identity as IE to get around stupid website restrictions.
Until one knows the way these statistics are gathered, they are meaningless.
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ggsinclair
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 04, 2005 8:45 pm    Post subject: RE: This is good to see! Reply with quote

Rhakios

Good point - but it raises the profile of Firefox and, ultimately, open source software.

That cant be a bad thing.

Cheers.

Gordon
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Rhakios
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 04, 2005 8:58 pm    Post subject: RE: This is good to see! Reply with quote

I can't help wondering if its profile isn't actually higher anyway.
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jjmac
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Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2005 2:32 am
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2005 1:44 am    Post subject: RE: This is good to see! Reply with quote

Yes, unless info is provided on the gathering method(s) used, it does become meaningless. Promotion that results from researches that later are revealed to be erronous, or even doctored, can only have the reverse effect ultimatley. And so should be avoided.


jm


Last edited by jjmac on Wed Nov 09, 2005 9:25 am; edited 1 time in total
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linuxgirlie
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2005 11:06 am    Post subject: RE: This is good to see! Reply with quote

I agree, and would love to know how they collect them, are they looking at the browser online at any given time, or do you have to visit certain website?
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jjmac
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 09, 2005 9:28 am    Post subject: RE: This is good to see! Reply with quote

Yes, it sounds a little suspicous to me ... would sites that keep hit counts have info like that available to be botted. Or are they accessing a sites cookie files ???, or something ?


jm
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nelz
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 09, 2005 10:11 am    Post subject: RE: This is good to see! Reply with quote

A browser identifies itself with the USER_AGENT variable. This can be logged by the site. Cookies have nothing to do with it, they are stored by the browser, not the server.

It is indicative, but not too reliable. You can change the User-Agent a browser sends (spoofing) and sometimes have to to get lamely written sites to accept you. A proportion of the hits from IE are actually people using other browsers and spoofing.

The sites you use the gather the statistics also affect the results. msn.com will get a higher proportion of hits from IE than mozilla.org, this site or Slashdot.
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Cogar



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PostPosted: Wed Nov 09, 2005 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Firefox is a good browser. Although I mildly prefer Konqueror, I still use Firefox for just this reason--I want people who run websites to know that people are using browsers other than IE. (I think Konqueror use is such a small percentage that it is typically ignored.) On the other hand, as Firefox use grows, so does its credibility to the general public. In turn, this could lead to more people switching.
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M-Saunders
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 09, 2005 4:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You could use Konqueror, but set it to identify itself as Firefox -- two birds, one stone! Smile

M
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nelz
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 09, 2005 5:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Can IE spoof? Every time someone lets you near a Windows system, set IE to spoof as Firefox Smile
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M0PHP
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 09, 2005 5:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yep, to a certain extent, IE can spoof Smile
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Nigel
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 09, 2005 7:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Time to create a .reg file to carry around on my USB key, methinks Twisted Evil Twisted Evil Twisted Evil
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Cogar



Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2005 12:50 pm
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 09, 2005 8:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

M-Saunders wrote:
You could use Konqueror, but set it to identify itself as Firefox -- two birds, one stone! Smile

M

Good idea--one that had not occurred to me for some reason. Thank you. Smile
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Rhakios
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 09, 2005 9:29 pm    Post subject: Re: RE: This is good to see! Reply with quote

nelz wrote:
A browser identifies itself with the USER_AGENT variable. This can be logged by the site. Cookies have nothing to do with it, they are stored by the browser, not the server.

It is indicative, but not too reliable. You can change the User-Agent a browser sends (spoofing) and sometimes have to to get lamely written sites to accept you. A proportion of the hits from IE are actually people using other browsers and spoofing.

The sites you use the gather the statistics also affect the results. msn.com will get a higher proportion of hits from IE than mozilla.org, this site or Slashdot.


The first bits of this post are rather my point. On several occasions I have noted that a fresh install of Opera will use IE for its identification, so any one who installs it and doesn't bother to change it (the vast majority of non-technical users) will be adding to the IE figures.
The again, how often have I changed my browsers ID because of some duff site, only to forget to change it back again for weeks.

It is especially when I bear in mind the number of people I speak to (non-linux users) who say they are using Firefox that I doubt these statistics.
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